• Who's at war

    From Gerhard Strangar@2:240/2188.575 to All on Tue Dec 27 18:23:43 2022
    High,

    can anybody point me out which document could help me out with something that I
    thought might be very simple:
    Is there an objective way of telling who's at war if no party declares it? I mean, if country A does have troops in country B and country C opens fire at those troops, is it a war on A or on B, both, neither or is it more complicated?



    Tschoe mit Oe
    Gerhard
    ---
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  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Gerhard Strangar on Tue Dec 27 10:48:18 2022
    High,

    can anybody point me out which document could help me out with something
    that thought might be very simple:
    Is there an objective way of telling who's at war if no party declares it? I mean, if country A does have troops in country B and country C opens fire at those troops, is it a war on A or on B, both, neither or is it more complicated?

    If country A has troops in country B then that is an act of war.

    If country C is firing on those troops then country C is helping to defend country B from country A, or at least trying to.

    --- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-6
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  • From Aaron Thomas@1:275/99 to Gerhard Strangar on Tue Dec 27 17:45:40 2022
    can anybody point me out which document could help me out with something that I thought might be very simple:
    Is there an objective way of telling who's at war if no party declares
    it? I mean, if country A does have troops in country B and country C
    opens fire at those troops, is it a war on A or on B, both, neither or
    is it more complicated?

    It's a fake war that allows Democrats and Zelenski to funnel money back to themselves.

    The real war is a brainwashing war, and the media is winning it. They say that you've got to (A) dump billions (blindy) into a failed state, plus start a war with Russia, or (B) Take the walk of shame for being a "Putin pal."

    There is NO option (C) either; it's one of those 2 things or it's nothing.

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  • From Dale Shipp@1:261/1466 to Aaron Thomas on Tue Dec 27 23:56:00 2022
    On 12-27-22 17:45, Aaron Thomas <=-
    spoke to Gerhard Strangar about Re: Who's at war <=-

    It's a fake war that allows Democrats and Zelenski to funnel money
    back to themselves.

    That is a pretty strong statement. What evidence to you have to support
    it?

    The real war is a brainwashing war, and the media is winning it. They
    say that you've got to (A) dump billions (blindy) into a failed state,

    What failed state? Ukraine seems to be doing fairly well when compaired
    to Putin's estimate of how his war would go.

    Dale Shipp
    fido_261_1466 (at) verizon (dot) net
    (1:261/1466)


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  • From Gerhard Strangar@2:240/2188.575 to Alan Ianson on Wed Dec 28 07:30:51 2022
    Am 27 Dec 22 10:48:18 schrob Alan Ianson an Gerhard Strangar zum Thema
    <Who's at war>

    If country A has troops in country B then that is an act of war.

    Apart from the possibility of having allies, which document says so?



    Tschoe mit Oe
    Gerhard
    ---
    * Origin: (2:240/2188.575)
  • From Gerhard Strangar@2:240/2188.575 to Aaron Thomas on Wed Dec 28 11:47:23 2022
    Am 27 Dec 22 17:45:40 schrob Aaron Thomas an Gerhard Strangar zum Thema
    <Re: Who's at war>

    The real war is a brainwashing war, and the media is winning it. They
    say that you've got to (A) dump billions (blindy) into a failed state, plus start a war with Russia, or (B) Take the walk of shame for being a "Putin pal."

    There is NO option (C) either; it's one of those 2 things or it's
    nothing.

    While your statement is completely unrelated to my question, what are the other
    options that you'd like to hear from the media? And why do you think noone is promoting them on the media?



    Tschoe mit Oe
    Gerhard
    ---
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  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Gerhard Strangar on Wed Dec 28 05:33:48 2022
    If country A has troops in country B then that is an act of war.

    Apart from the possibility of having allies, which document says so?

    What do you want a document for?

    If country A sends a military force into country B and begins some kind of military operations that is an act of war.

    Look up "war" in the dictionary, that will give you some documentation.

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  • From Aaron Thomas@1:275/99 to Dale Shipp on Wed Dec 28 17:16:02 2022
    It's a fake war that allows Democrats and Zelenski to funnel money back to themselves.

    That is a pretty strong statement. What evidence to you have to support it?

    The proof is in the fact that Biden did nothing when the conflict began; he waited until there were dead bodies to back him up, before he lifted a finger. Now, since he waited too long, his solution is "fund somebody else's war against mighty Russia."

    What failed state? Ukraine seems to be doing fairly well when compaired to Putin's estimate of how his war would go.

    Ukraine is a failed state. They have a "leader" who knew an invasion was imminent, but yet he let his people die. This all comes after he let Biden manipulate his "justice system." Failure build on top of more failure.

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  • From Aaron Thomas@1:275/99 to Gerhard Strangar on Wed Dec 28 17:23:34 2022
    While your statement is completely unrelated to my question, what are
    the other options that you'd like to hear from the media? And why do you think noone is promoting them on the media?

    I'd like for the media to keep the facts in a handy place, so that way they can refer back to them when their imaginations start to run wild.

    Fact #1: Biden has no diplomacy skills; he let this war happen.
    Fact #2: Biden's motto: "send money, but not troops, and not oversight."
    Fact #3: Trump's "nice guy" attitude with Putin could have averted all this Fact #4: The media (and covid) told America to vote for Biden.

    Now, while having all that info tattooed on their foreheads, the media ought
    to do some explaining about the role that they played in the creation of this war and why they did it;

    Was it because Trump's racist?
    Americans have too much money?
    Ukraine had too many alive people?

    Hmmm, hmmm, hmmm, after thinking about all this, my conclusion is that Democrats love money, and what better way to get their hands on billions than to fund a war with no oversight? Zelenski can say "I spend 10 billion of it on biological weapons so I could give cancer to all the Russian soldiers." But none of that; we have no clue as to where the money went, all we know is that they want more of it and that they ain't gonna tell us nothin about what they're spending it on. Smells fishy.

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  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Aaron Thomas on Wed Dec 28 16:50:32 2022
    Fact #1: Biden has no diplomacy skills; he let this war happen.

    This is not and never was Biden's war. That was a choice Russia made.

    Fact #2: Biden's motto: "send money, but not troops, and not oversight."

    Do you want, were you thinking that Biden should send troops?

    Fact #3: Trump's "nice guy" attitude with Putin could have averted all this

    No, Trump would have made an even bigger mess.

    Fact #4: The media (and covid) told America to vote for Biden.

    It was neither the media nor covid's fault that Trump lost the election.

    Now, while having all that info tattooed on their foreheads, the media ought to do some explaining about the role that they played in the creation of this war and why they did it;

    How is "the media" responsible for "this war"?

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  • From Dale Shipp@1:261/1466 to Aaron Thomas on Thu Dec 29 00:04:00 2022
    On 12-28-22 17:16, Aaron Thomas <=-
    spoke to Dale Shipp about Re: Who's at war <=-


    It's a fake war that allows Democrats and Zelenski to funnel money
    back to themselves.

    That is a pretty strong statement. What evidence to you have to support it?

    The proof is in the fact that Biden did nothing when the conflict
    began; he waited until there were dead bodies to back him up, before he lifted a finger. Now, since he waited too long, his solution is "fund somebody else's war against mighty Russia."

    Rubbish fake news. Tell us what you would have done.

    What failed state? Ukraine seems to be doing fairly well when compaired to Putin's estimate of how his war would go.

    Ukraine is a failed state. They have a "leader" who knew an invasion
    was imminent, but yet he let his people die. This all comes after he
    let Biden manipulate his "justice system." Failure build on top of more failure.

    More rubbish. How would you have handled the situation?

    Dale Shipp
    fido_261_1466 (at) verizon (dot) net
    (1:261/1466)




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  • From Gerhard Strangar@2:240/2188.575 to Alan Ianson on Thu Dec 29 06:37:39 2022
    Am 28 Dec 22 05:33:48 schrob Alan Ianson an Gerhard Strangar zum Thema
    <Who's at war>

    If country A has troops in country B then that is an act of war.
    Apart from the possibility of having allies, which document says so?
    What do you want a document for?

    Because I'd like to read it instead of getting opinions from people who haven't
    read it, either.



    Tschoe mit Oe
    Gerhard
    ---
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  • From Gerhard Strangar@2:240/2188.575 to Aaron Thomas on Thu Dec 29 06:56:30 2022
    Am 28 Dec 22 17:23:34 schrob Aaron Thomas an Gerhard Strangar zum Thema
    <Re: Who's at war>

    While your statement is completely unrelated to my question, what
    are the other options that you'd like to hear from the media? And
    why do you think noone is promoting them on the media?

    I'd like for the media to keep the facts in a handy place, so that way they can refer back to them when their imaginations start to run wild.

    Fact #1: Biden has no diplomacy skills; he let this war happen.
    Fact #2: Biden's motto: "send money, but not troops, and not oversight." Fact #3: Trump's "nice guy" attitude with Putin could have averted all this Fact #4: The media (and covid) told America to vote for Biden.

    Now, while having all that info tattooed on their foreheads, the media ought to do some explaining about the role that they played in the creation of this war and why they did it;

    Was it because Trump's racist?
    Americans have too much money?
    Ukraine had too many alive people?

    Hmmm, hmmm, hmmm, after thinking about all this, my conclusion is that Democrats love money, and what better way to get their hands on billions than to fund a war with no oversight? Zelenski can say "I spend 10
    billion of it on biological weapons so I could give cancer to all the Russian soldiers." But none of that; we have no clue as to where the
    money went, all we know is that they want more of it and that they ain't gonna tell us nothin about what they're spending it on. Smells fishy.

    Sorry for quoting all of what you wrote, but I fail to see any of the other options you said you are missing from the media. Moreover, your "fact #3" is just an assumption, which you even point out by using "could".
    Is your third option hidden in "fact #2", would you have sent troups to Ukraine
    before the invasion of 2022? Then we'd be back to my original question, which you couldn't answer.
    What do you mean by "covid told America to vote for Biden"?



    Tschoe mit Oe
    Gerhard
    ---
    * Origin: (2:240/2188.575)
  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Gerhard Strangar on Wed Dec 28 23:04:30 2022
    If country A has troops in country B then that is an act of war.
    Apart from the possibility of having allies, which document says so?
    What do you want a document for?

    Because I'd like to read it instead of getting opinions from people who haven't read it, either.

    I hope you find your document.

    --- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-6
    * Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757)
  • From Aaron Thomas@1:275/99 to Dale Shipp on Thu Dec 29 17:26:43 2022
    The proof is in the fact that Biden did nothing when the conflict began; he waited until there were dead bodies to back him up, before lifted a finger. Now, since he waited too long, his solution is "fund somebody else's war against mighty Russia."

    Rubbish fake news. Tell us what you would have done.

    What's fake about my summary? It seems accurate to me. I would have negotiated with Putin and Zelenski. "Putin wants to annex your country and if you don't let him do it, civilians will die, so hand over the keys before someone gets hurt, because you can't afford a war and neither can the USA."

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  • From Aaron Thomas@1:275/99 to Gerhard Strangar on Thu Dec 29 17:48:39 2022
    Sorry for quoting all of what you wrote, but I fail to see any of the other options you said you are missing from the media. Moreover, your "fact #3" is just an assumption, which you even point out by using "could". Is your third option hidden in "fact #2", would you have sent troups to Ukraine before the invasion of 2022? Then we'd be back to my original question, which you couldn't answer.
    What do you mean by "covid told America to vote for Biden"?

    Keep in mind that the media and false accusations against Trump are what led
    to his removal from power; the voters didn't take that stuff lightly.

    The media did all this, in this order:
    Installed the Biden Shadow Regime 1.0
    Watched/reported about the Russian troop deployment along the Ukranian border Watched/reported about civilians being tortured and blown to bits Watched/reported about billions of American taxpayer dollars handed to Ukraine

    But they leave important questions unanswered:
    Have you ever played rock, paper, scissors?
    How does paper defeat nuclear armed Russia?
    How will the USA funding Russia's opposition affect our int'l relationship?
    How much Russian territory has Ukraine conquered so far?
    How did we "outspend Russia" but yet we're still losing the war?
    Why are Democrats opposed to oversight on billions of dollars?
    How does David Muir keep such a straight face?

    You don't have to try to answer all that, but my point is that the media doesn't answer questions or cover stories that could incriminate themselves or the Biden Shadow Regime.

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  • From Gerhard Strangar@2:240/2188.575 to Aaron Thomas on Fri Dec 30 19:31:20 2022
    Am 29 Dec 22 17:48:39 schrob Aaron Thomas an Gerhard Strangar zum Thema
    <Re: Who's at war>

    But they leave important questions unanswered:
    Have you ever played rock, paper, scissors?

    I have.

    How does paper defeat nuclear armed Russia?

    I've only played the classic version without Spock, lizard, but I'd assume it covers the silo, just like it covers the well. ;-)

    How much Russian territory has Ukraine conquered so far?

    Ukraine is defending it's own territory, I'd not call it conquering when you're
    regaining control, but AFAIK it's about 70,000 square kilomters.

    How did we "outspend Russia" but yet we're still losing the war?

    Assuming by "we" you mean the USA, you're not losing it, you're not even in it.
    It's a war between Russia and Ukraine.

    How does David Muir keep such a straight face?

    I don't even know who that is.

    You don't have to try to answer all that, but my point is that the media doesn't answer questions or cover stories that could incriminate themselves or the Biden Shadow Regime.

    I'm still wondering what the "option C" is that you are missing from the media.
    Do you know another option? Are you just missing on "your" media, did you check
    foreign media?



    Tschoe mit Oe
    Gerhard
    ---
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  • From Gerhard Strangar@2:240/2188.575 to Aaron Thomas on Fri Dec 30 20:18:24 2022
    Am 29 Dec 22 17:26:43 schrob Aaron Thomas an Dale Shipp zum Thema
    <Re: Who's at war>

    The proof is in the fact that Biden did nothing when the
    conflict AT> began; he waited until there were dead bodies to
    back him up, before AT> lifted a finger. Now, since he waited too
    long, his solution is "fund AT> somebody else's war against
    mighty Russia."
    Rubbish fake news. Tell us what you would have done.
    What's fake about my summary?

    The timeline. The conflict began in 2013, the Russians invaded Crimea in 2014. Biden became president in 2021.

    It seems accurate to me. I would have
    negotiated with Putin and Zelenski. "Putin wants to annex your country
    and if you don't let him do it, civilians will die, so hand over the
    keys before someone gets hurt, because you can't afford a war and
    neither can the USA."

    The people of Ukraine don't seem to want another Wiktor Janukowytsch.



    Tschoe mit Oe
    Gerhard
    ---
    * Origin: (2:240/2188.575)
  • From Dale Shipp@1:261/1466 to Aaron Thomas on Fri Dec 30 23:56:00 2022
    On 12-29-22 17:26, Aaron Thomas <=-
    spoke to Dale Shipp about Re: Who's at war <=-


    The proof is in the fact that Biden did nothing when the conflict
    began; he waited until there were dead bodies to
    back him up, before
    lifted a finger. Now, since he waited too long,
    his solution is "fund
    somebody else's war against mighty Russia."

    Rubbish fake news. Tell us what you would have done.

    What's fake about my summary? It seems accurate to me.

    You say that Biden did nothing when the conflict began. That is false.
    He (with other partners in EU and NATO) imposed severe sanctions on
    Russia.

    It is not just somebody else's war against Russia. If Russia was
    allowed to annex Ukraine without serious opposition, then his next move
    might be to play the same thing on other east European countries. His
    goal is to recreate the Russia empire of old, or at least the equivant
    of the USSR.

    I would have
    negotiated with Putin and Zelenski. "Putin wants to annex your country
    and if you don't let him do it, civilians will die, so hand over the
    keys before someone gets hurt, because you can't afford a war and
    neither can the USA."

    Really! You would just turn over the keys and surrender without
    protest. That would empower Putin to do even more.

    Dale Shipp
    fido_261_1466 (at) verizon (dot) net
    (1:261/1466)



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  • From Dale Shipp@1:261/1466 to Aaron Thomas on Sat Dec 31 00:11:02 2022
    On 12-29-22 17:48, Aaron Thomas <=-
    spoke to Gerhard Strangar about Re: Who's at war <=-

    How much Russian territory has Ukraine conquered so far?

    None -- but they have regained Ukrainian territory from the Russians.

    How did we "outspend Russia" but yet we're still losing the war?

    Outspending the USSR is how Regan caused the collapse of the USSR.
    Ukraine is not losing the war in Ukraine.

    Dale Shipp
    fido_261_1466 (at) verizon (dot) net
    (1:261/1466)


    ... Shipwrecked in Silver Spring, Maryland. 00:10:09, 31 Dec 2022
    ___ Blue Wave/DOS v2.30

    --- Maximus/NT 3.01
    * Origin: Owl's Anchor (1:261/1466)
  • From Aaron Thomas@1:275/99 to Gerhard Strangar on Sat Dec 31 04:55:26 2022
    How much Russian territory has Ukraine conquered so far?

    Ukraine is defending it's own territory, I'd not call it conquering when you're regaining control, but AFAIK it's about 70,000 square kilomters.

    Ukraine lost the war the day that the 1st Ukranian civilian died while trying to defend their home from Russian soldiers. They lost the war the day that
    they lost control of their own territory, and they lost the war the day that Joe Biden was crowned king of the USA.

    How did we "outspend Russia" but yet we're still losing the war?

    Assuming by "we" you mean the USA, you're not losing it, you're not even in it. It's a war between Russia and Ukraine.

    When the USA funds a war, and everybody knows about it, the USA is *in* a war. Russia will retalliate when the moment is right

    If the USA wanted to "stay out of the war," then they shouldn't have sided with Zelenski, and they shouldn't have sent him billions of dollars for him to piss away at the casino.

    I'm still wondering what the "option C" is that you are missing from media. Do you know another option? Are you just missing on "your" media, did you check foreign media?

    I apologize, I've lost focus. What do you mean by "option C" for the media?

    Is there any point in me checking foreign media? Aren't they all "in this together" like they always say? ;)

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  • From Aaron Thomas@1:275/99 to Gerhard Strangar on Sat Dec 31 05:01:16 2022
    What's fake about my summary?

    The timeline. The conflict began in 2013, the Russians invaded Crimea in 2014. Biden became president in 2021.

    They invaded Crimea in 2014, when Joe Biden was Vice President of the USA,
    the Russian effort was on hiatus while Trump was president, but as soon as Joe became president in 2021, Russian troops were deployed along the Ukranian border. I'm not trying to BS you - did the media forget to tell you all that?

    negotiated with Putin and Zelenski. "Putin wants to annex your country and if you don't let him do it, civilians will die, so hand over the keys before someone gets hurt, because you can't afford a war and neither can the USA."

    The people of Ukraine don't seem to want another Wiktor Janukowytsch.

    Why not? It's Zelenski who refuses to get a job. He wants to be "president of Ukraine," but Ukraine is no longer in service. And he should swallow his pride and get a real job. And he should apologize for being the world's worst leader.

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  • From Aaron Thomas@1:275/99 to Dale Shipp on Sat Dec 31 06:08:21 2022
    What's fake about my summary? It seems accurate to me.

    You say that Biden did nothing when the conflict began. That is false.
    He (with other partners in EU and NATO) imposed severe sanctions on Russia.

    Not severe enough. It was tough talk.

    It is not just somebody else's war against Russia. If Russia was
    allowed to annex Ukraine without serious opposition, then his next move might be to play the same thing on other east European countries. His goal is to recreate the Russia empire of old, or at least the equivant
    of the USSR.

    Our "opposition" should have ended with those "severe santions" you mentioned. At least at that point we weren't embroiled in a war. Now we are though.

    Billions in aid is working about as effectively as Biden's "diplomacy."

    If what you say is correct about Russia trying to rebuild the USSR, then why are we relying on the weak, dilapidated, failed state of Ukraine to curb it
    for us? It's like giving a homeless person a bunch of cash and telling them "the whole world is depending on you to fight off the Russians," and then they go to the liquor store.

    negotiated with Putin and Zelenski. "Putin wants to annex your countr and if you don't let him do it, civilians will die, so hand over the keys before someone gets hurt, because you can't afford a war and neither can the USA."

    Really! You would just turn over the keys and surrender without
    protest. That would empower Putin to do even more.

    We can't defend Ukraine by throwing money at them. We tried, and it didn't work. Wanna throw some more money around?

    Our military can defend Ukraine better than our money can. However, there's probably some concern about our military going over there and finding out the truth about where all our money went.

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  • From Gerhard Strangar@2:240/2188.575 to Aaron Thomas on Sun Jan 1 12:43:17 2023
    Am 31 Dec 22 04:55:26 schrob Aaron Thomas an Gerhard Strangar zum Thema
    <Re: Who's at war>

    Ukraine lost the war the day that the 1st Ukranian civilian died while trying to defend their home from Russian soldiers.

    Okay, let's go with your "unconventional" definition of losing.
    Wikipedia says that 68 civilians died in Perl Harbour, which means the USA lost
    World War II. Switzerland even lost it without being in it in the first place. For the Vietnam War, Wikipedia lists dead Vietnamese civilians, but no dead U.S. civilians, so both North and South Vietnam lost, the USA did not. Or ist it the Confederate States of America?

    When the USA funds a war, and everybody knows about it, the USA is *in*
    a war. Russia will retalliate when the moment is right
    If the USA wanted to "stay out of the war," then they shouldn't have
    sided with Zelenski, and they shouldn't have sent him billions of
    dollars for him to piss away at the casino.

    Selenskyj got elected in 2019, like I mentioned before, the conflict is older than that. And the Trump administration sent weapons to Ukraine before stating that Putin was a clever guy for invading the country that they sent the weapons
    to.

    I'm still wondering what the "option C" is that you are missing from
    media. Do you know another option? Are you just missing on "your"
    media, did you check foreign media?
    I apologize, I've lost focus. What do you mean by "option C" for the media?

    2022-12-27 you wrote this:
    The real war is a brainwashing war, and the media is winning it. They
    say that you've got to (A) dump billions (blindy) into a failed state,
    plus start a war with Russia, or (B) Take the walk of shame for being
    a "Putin pal."
    There is NO option (C) either; it's one of those 2 things or it's
    nothing.

    So, what's the option C that you are missing?



    Tschoe mit Oe
    Gerhard
    ---
    * Origin: (2:240/2188.575)
  • From Gerhard Strangar@2:240/2188.575 to Aaron Thomas on Sun Jan 1 13:40:45 2023
    Am 31 Dec 22 05:01:16 schrob Aaron Thomas an Gerhard Strangar zum Thema
    <Re: Who's at war>

    The timeline. The conflict began in 2013, the Russians invaded
    Crimea in 2014. Biden became president in 2021.
    They invaded Crimea in 2014, when Joe Biden was Vice President of the
    USA,

    Can you name some of Bidens actions related to Ukraine when he was in charge because of being vice president?

    the Russian effort was on hiatus while Trump was president, but as
    soon as Joe became president in 2021, Russian troops were deployed along the Ukranian border. I'm not trying to BS you - did the media forget to tell you all that?

    Can you be more specific? What days are you talking about? Because Reuters reported about tanks and howitzers being moved to Kuzminsky and Matveev Kurgan on 2015-05-28.
    In 2020-03 the OSCE reported 700 cease fire violations per day (opposed to 800 per year in 2019) https://www.osce.org/special-monitoring-mission-to-ukraine/449458

    And what you're saing is: Nothing was wrong while the car was heading for the concrete wall at 250 km/h in Autopilot mode, but as soon as the driver slammed on the brakes, it crashed into that wall; so it's the driver's fault.

    Why not? It's Zelenski who refuses to get a job. He wants to be
    "president of Ukraine," but Ukraine is no longer in service.

    Which day was the last one?



    Tschoe mit Oe
    Gerhard
    ---
    * Origin: (2:240/2188.575)
  • From Aaron Thomas@1:123/525 to Gerhard Strangar on Wed Apr 5 09:06:39 2023
    Ukraine lost the war the day that the 1st Ukranian civilian died GS>
    while
    trying to defend their home from Russian soldiers.

    Okay, let's go with your "unconventional" definition of losing.
    Wikipedia says that 68 civilians died in Perl Harbour, which means the

    There was no need to spill any Ukranian civilian blood. It all could have been averted, but Democrats..

    The real war is a brainwashing war, and the media is winning it. They say that you've got to (A) dump billions (blindy) into a failed GS>
    state,
    plus start a war with Russia, or (B) Take the walk of shame for being a "Putin pal."
    There is NO option (C) either; it's one of those 2 things or it's nothing.

    So, what's the option C that you are missing?

    Thanks. There is no "option C" for the media. The media (and their followers) are either A) Supportive of money dumping or B) Not supportive of it ("Putin pals.") (There's not much profit for them in option B!)

    Option C, for the media, is talk about it. Talk about where the US taxpayer donations are going, talk about how and when we'll win the war, or talk about how we're not sending any troops but yet we still expect to "win a war."

    Option C is not really an option for employees of the left. Their job is to make idiots think that their taxes are going to a good cause.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/02/26 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: alcoholidaybbs.com / Est. 1995 / Columbia, SC (1:123/525)
  • From Aaron Thomas@1:123/525 to Gerhard Strangar on Wed Apr 5 09:18:39 2023
    The timeline. The conflict began in 2013, the Russians invaded
    Crimea in 2014. Biden became president in 2021.
    They invaded Crimea in 2014, when Joe Biden was Vice President of the USA,

    Can you name some of Bidens actions related to Ukraine when he was in charge because of being vice president?

    He was in charge of millions of dollars worth of "military aid" to Ukraine at the time. He threatened to withhold it unless Viktor Shokin (prosecutor who was
    investigating Hunter Biden) were fired. Then, voila, Shokin was fired. Then, voila, millions in "military aid" was handed to the television star/president of the failed territory known as Ukraine. What did he even do with that military aid? He let Putin invade and Crimea was annexed!

    the Russian effort was on hiatus while Trump was president, but as soon as Joe became president in 2021, Russian troops were deployed alo the Ukranian border. I'm not trying to BS you - did the media forget t tell you all that?

    Can you be more specific? What days are you talking about? Because
    Reuters reported about tanks and howitzers being moved to Kuzminsky and

    I can't be more specific. The media began it's "Look at what's happening in Ukraine" story almost immediately after Biden took office here in the states. It looks like a complex plan that's unfolding. I miss the good old days when people would just rob a bank when they wanted to scamper off with a ton of cash
    that doesn't belong to them.

    Why not? It's Zelenski who refuses to get a job. He wants to be "president of Ukraine," but Ukraine is no longer in service.

    Which day was the last one?

    The day that the television star/president allowed Russia to kill civilians. That was the END of Ukraine. And if that wasn't "ending" enough for you, then it was the day that Zelesnky separated families and forced unarmed men to
    fight the Russian army.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/02/26 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: alcoholidaybbs.com / Est. 1995 / Columbia, SC (1:123/525)
  • From Darren Darko@1:218/700 to Aaron Thomas on Wed Apr 5 13:31:46 2023
    Re: Re: Who's at war
    By: Aaron Thomas to Gerhard Strangar on Wed Apr 05 2023 09:06 am

    There was no need to spill any Ukranian civilian blood. It all could have been averted, but Democrats..

    Thew decision to provide aid to a democracy that was invaded by a foreign dictatorial power was initially bipartizan.

    It is also in the Constitution that the US will help maintain democracy around the world, which has been a bedrock of the last 150 years of US Foreign Policy.

    If you don't support Ukraine's right to defend its democracy, you are un-American. If you support Russia, you are an ally of an enemy of the United States and democracy around the world.

    There, I fixed it for you.
    --- SBBSecho 3.20-Win32
    * Origin: http://realitycheckbbs.org | tomorrow's retro tech (1:218/700)
  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Aaron Thomas on Wed Apr 5 14:56:02 2023
    There was no need to spill any Ukranian civilian blood. It all could have been averted, but Democrats..

    Just so you know..

    It wasn't/isn't democrats that are spilling Ukrainian blood.

    It is the Russian Federation that started a war in Ukraine, and continues that war even today.

    Option C is not really an option for employees of the left. Their job is to make idiots think that their taxes are going to a good cause.

    I suppose America could just ignore what is happening in Ukraine and elsewhere if you think that would be a good thing.

    Do you think that would be a good thing?

    --- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-6
    * Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757)
  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Aaron Thomas on Wed Apr 5 14:58:14 2023
    The day that the television star/president allowed Russia to kill civilians.

    What silly talk.

    That was the END of Ukraine. And if that wasn't "ending" enough for you, then it was the day that Zelesnky separated families and forced unarmed men to fight the Russian army.

    Zelensky did no such thing.

    --- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-6
    * Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757)
  • From Aaron Thomas@1:123/525 to Darren Darko on Wed Apr 5 18:55:10 2023
    Thew decision to provide aid to a democracy that was invaded by a foreign dictatorial power was initially bipartizan.

    They made a decision?

    It is also in the Constitution that the US will help maintain democracy around the world, which has been a bedrock of the last 150 years of US Foreign Policy.

    Which was it then? A decision by lawmakers or just enforcement of the constitution? Where was the USA when Honduras' democracy was deposed? We can't defend other peoples' democracy; they have a different definition than we do. Do you think Ukrainian men voted in favor of fighting off the Russian Army with
    their fists?

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/02/26 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: alcoholidaybbs.com / Est. 1995 / Columbia, SC (1:123/525)
  • From Aaron Thomas@1:123/525 to Alan Ianson on Wed Apr 5 19:03:31 2023
    It wasn't/isn't democrats that are spilling Ukrainian blood.

    It is the Russian Federation that started a war in Ukraine, and
    continues that war even today.

    Joe could have stopped the war but he refused to negotiate with Putin. Same thing with Zelensky. They're buds. They squander money together.

    Option C is not really an option for employees of the left. Their job
    is
    make idiots think that their taxes are going to a good cause.

    I suppose America could just ignore what is happening in Ukraine and elsewhere if you think that would be a good thing.

    Yea that would be a good thing. We've got no money to spare. It's borrowed and the American people will be paying it back plus interest.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/02/26 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: alcoholidaybbs.com / Est. 1995 / Columbia, SC (1:123/525)
  • From Aaron Thomas@1:123/525 to Alan Ianson on Wed Apr 5 19:13:16 2023
    That was the END of Ukraine. And if that wasn't "ending" enough for AI>
    you,
    it was the day that Zelesnky separated families and forced unarmed men
    t
    fight the Russian army.

    Zelensky did no such thing.

    It's widely known.

    https://tinyurl.com/2p8mwvav

    https://tinyurl.com/5n92x3ee

    Are you "fighting age?" I'm 43. If I lived in Ukraine, I'd be forced to defend myself from the Russian army with my fists.

    Where's Zelensky? Hiding? He should be invading Russia, trying to assassinate Putin. But he's a tv star so he's busy with other stuff.

    I promise you this: The Ukraine war will end as soon as we get a Republican president. Not any sooner though! Joe & Vlod are gonna milk us dry.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/02/26 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: alcoholidaybbs.com / Est. 1995 / Columbia, SC (1:123/525)
  • From Gregory Deyss@1:267/150 to Darren Darko on Wed Apr 5 19:33:30 2023
    If you don't support Ukraine's right to defend its democracy, you are un-American. If you support Russia, you are an ally of an enemy of the United States and democracy around the world.

    It's terrible what is happening in Ukraine, but I am not thrilled with the USA sending over a never ending hundreds of millions to Ukraine.
    Could be over, helluva lot quicker if there was Air Support...
    but that would also bring to an end the money cash machine, that is also generating a winfall, for the people who crave war.

    A diplomatic solution must be found, Donald Trump has said he could end the fighting by having a conversion w/ Putin and Zelenskyy.

    WWIII is just around the corner, if something is not done.

    I, in no way support Putin, but I do not think that WE within the USA are getting the total truth from the Biden Administration, w/ many topics.

    I love my country, but currently I can not trust the current occupants under the big top, known as The White House because it is an absolute circus.

    .______ Ŀ Ŀ Ŀ Ŀ ͻ Ŀ
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    * Origin: Capital Station BBS * Telnet://csbbs.dyndns.org * (1:267/150)
  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Aaron Thomas on Wed Apr 5 17:27:28 2023
    It wasn't/isn't democrats that are spilling Ukrainian blood.

    It is the Russian Federation that started a war in Ukraine, and
    continues that war even today.

    Joe could have stopped the war but he refused to negotiate with Putin. Same thing with Zelensky. They're buds. They squander money together.

    The war in Ukraine was by decision of the kremlin, not Joe or anyone else.

    The White House (that includes Joe) has been negotiating with Russia to stop the war but as you must know Russia has other plans.

    --- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-6
    * Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757)
  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Aaron Thomas on Wed Apr 5 17:35:04 2023
    That was the END of Ukraine. And if that wasn't "ending" enough for AI> >> you,
    it was the day that Zelesnky separated families and forced unarmed men
    t
    fight the Russian army.

    Zelensky did no such thing.

    It's widely known.

    https://tinyurl.com/2p8mwvav

    https://tinyurl.com/5n92x3ee

    I'll have a look when I have internet access.

    Are you "fighting age?" I'm 43. If I lived in Ukraine, I'd be forced to defend myself from the Russian army with my fists.

    I am fighting age but I am a lover, not a fighter.

    The people of Ukraine must defend themselves with whatever they have since the invasion of Russia.

    Where's Zelensky? Hiding? He should be invading Russia, trying to assassinate Putin. But he's a tv star so he's busy with other stuff.

    He is a TV star, I never watched any of his shows so I don't know how good they
    are.

    Zelenski is more than that now. Much more.

    I promise you this: The Ukraine war will end as soon as we get a Republican president.

    I don't think so. Even a republican president would support Ukraine. Not the MAGA sort I understand, but a republican would. You know, a man who stands for America.

    Not any sooner though! Joe & Vlod are gonna milk us dry.

    Joe & Vlod could care less about your milk!

    --- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-6
    * Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757)
  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Gregory Deyss on Wed Apr 5 17:36:36 2023
    A diplomatic solution must be found, Donald Trump has said he could end the fighting by having a conversion w/ Putin and Zelenskyy.

    Very little of anything said by Donald Trump has proven to be true.

    --- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-6
    * Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757)
  • From Gregory Deyss@1:267/150 to Alan Ianson on Thu Apr 6 07:37:23 2023
    On 05 Apr 2023, Alan Ianson said the following...

    A diplomatic solution must be found, Donald Trump has said he could end
    t
    fighting by having a conversion w/ Putin and Zelenskyy.

    Very little of anything said by Donald Trump has proven to be true.

    Trumps recent message was that if such a conversation of peace is not provided an opportunity it will be catastrophic for all of us.

    It is also very interesting... all that I wrote *this* is what you come back with.

    .______ Ŀ Ŀ Ŀ Ŀ ͻ Ŀ
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    ... Nine times out of ten the statisticians are wrong

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    * Origin: Capital Station BBS * Telnet://csbbs.dyndns.org * (1:267/150)
  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Gregory Deyss on Thu Apr 6 05:17:00 2023
    Very little of anything said by Donald Trump has proven to be true.

    Trumps recent message was that if such a conversation of peace is not provided an opportunity it will be catastrophic for all of us.

    It is also very interesting... all that I wrote *this* is what you come back with.

    I made the simple statement that Donald Trump is a liar. I said that because, well, Donald Trump is a liar and we shouldn't believe what he says, because he is a liar.

    --- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-6
    * Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757)
  • From Gerhard Strangar@2:240/2188.575 to Aaron Thomas on Thu Apr 6 07:16:37 2023
    Am 05 Apr 23 09:06:39 schrob Aaron Thomas an Gerhard Strangar zum Thema
    <Re: Who's at war>

    Option C, for the media, is talk about it. Talk about where the US taxpayer donations are going, talk about how and when we'll win the war, or talk about how we're not sending any troops but yet we still expect
    to "win a war."

    I wanted to know what your option C was. What's your strategy?



    Tschoe mit Oe
    Gerhard
    ---
    * Origin: (2:240/2188.575)
  • From Gerhard Strangar@2:240/2188.575 to Aaron Thomas on Thu Apr 6 07:21:22 2023
    Am 05 Apr 23 09:18:39 schrob Aaron Thomas an Gerhard Strangar zum Thema
    <Re: Who's at war>

    "president of Ukraine," but Ukraine is no longer in service.
    Which day was the last one?
    The day that the television star/president allowed Russia to kill civilians. That was the END of Ukraine.

    Name a date.



    Tschoe mit Oe
    Gerhard
    ---
    * Origin: (2:240/2188.575)
  • From Gerhard Strangar@2:240/2188.575 to Aaron Thomas on Thu Apr 6 07:26:12 2023
    Am 05 Apr 23 19:03:31 schrob Aaron Thomas an Alan Ianson zum Thema
    <Re: Who's at war>

    Joe could have stopped the war but he refused to negotiate with Putin.

    He's not authorized to negotiate about Ukrainian territory.



    Tschoe mit Oe
    Gerhard
    ---
    * Origin: (2:240/2188.575)
  • From Gerhard Strangar@2:240/2188.575 to Aaron Thomas on Thu Apr 6 07:37:44 2023
    Am 05 Apr 23 19:13:16 schrob Aaron Thomas an Alan Ianson zum Thema
    <Re: Who's at war>

    I promise you this: The Ukraine war will end as soon as we get a Republican president.

    Just like the wall the building of which started on "day one"?



    Tschoe mit Oe
    Gerhard
    ---
    * Origin: (2:240/2188.575)
  • From Gregory Deyss@1:267/150 to Alan Ianson on Thu Apr 6 20:38:21 2023
    On 06 Apr 2023, Alan Ianson said the following...

    Very little of anything said by Donald Trump has proven to be true.

    Trumps recent message was that if such a conversation of peace is not provided an opportunity it will be catastrophic for all of us.

    It is also very interesting... all that I wrote *this* is what you come
    b
    with.

    I made the simple statement that Donald Trump is a liar. I said that because, well, Donald Trump is a liar and we shouldn't believe what he says, because he is a liar.
    You can claim whatever you wish, even though it is completely baseless in fact,
    more to the point, what you are suffering from is known as Trump Derangement Syndrome. If you want to have an intelligent conversation to discuss where he allegedly lied, we can certainly do that.

    Be Advised I am an American who supports Trump 100%
    (the previous as well as the next American President)
    I can defend Trump very effectively. or we can discuss Biden in comparison to Trump, Joe Biden has been a complete train wreck. As seen recently in your house of commons. The choice is yours to make of course, give it your best shot
    and risk the embarrassment or hide. Either way, The ball is in your court eh'

    Besides what are you complaining about? You're a Canadian - you don't
    have a dog in this fight, nor do you have any skin in the game.

    .______ Ŀ Ŀ Ŀ Ŀ ͻ Ŀ
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    * Origin: Capital Station BBS * Telnet://csbbs.dyndns.org * (1:267/150)
  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Gregory Deyss on Thu Apr 6 17:47:22 2023
    Be Advised I am an American who supports Trump 100%

    Yes, that is obvious.

    (the previous as well as the next American President)

    I know he is running, or planning to run. I don't know who the next president wil be but I don't think it will be Donald Trump.

    Besides what are you complaining about? You're a Canadian - you don't
    have a dog in this fight, nor do you have any skin in the game.

    I wasn't complaining. I stated the obvious fact that Donald Trump is a liar. Nothing more nothing less.

    --- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-6
    * Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757)
  • From Aaron Thomas@1:123/525 to Alan Ianson on Thu Apr 6 20:48:24 2023
    The war in Ukraine was by decision of the kremlin, not Joe or anyone
    else.

    The White House (that includes Joe) has been negotiating with Russia to stop the war but as you must know Russia has other plans.

    That sounds like a happy ending to a fairy tale, but for some reason, I've never heard news of such meetings. But if I start believing in them, will that make them exist?

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/02/26 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: alcoholidaybbs.com / Est. 1995 / Columbia, SC (1:123/525)
  • From Aaron Thomas@1:123/525 to Alan Ianson on Thu Apr 6 21:08:39 2023
    I am fighting age but I am a lover, not a fighter.

    The Russian army isn't gonna come to lie in bed with you!

    The people of Ukraine must defend themselves with whatever they have
    since the invasion of Russia.

    That's what I'm saying. Why does their president make them resort to such desperation? Would you still support Trudeau if he left you with no lube and a whole Russian army to make love to? This is why I no longer support Zelensky because he represents a very different type of democracy than the kind that we enforce in the states.

    Zelenski is more than that now. Much more.

    Yea, now he's made it to elite status. We should be congratulating him.

    I don't think so. Even a republican president would support Ukraine. Not the MAGA sort I understand, but a republican would. You know, a man who stands for America.

    Ukraine has nothing to do with America. America was established in 1776, Ukraine in the late 1990s.

    Not any sooner though! Joe & Vlod are gonna milk us dry.

    Joe & Vlod could care less about your milk!

    Why defend them so much? Why do you trust them so much?

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/02/26 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: alcoholidaybbs.com / Est. 1995 / Columbia, SC (1:123/525)
  • From Aaron Thomas@1:123/525 to Gerhard Strangar on Thu Apr 6 21:33:06 2023
    Option C, for the media, is talk about it. Talk about where the US taxpayer donations are going, talk about how and when we'll win the wa or talk about how we're not sending any troops but yet we still expect to "win a war."

    I wanted to know what your option C was. What's your strategy?

    We should depose failed leader Zelensky and then negotiate a transition to Russia plan for the surviving colonists. Then give a warning to other soon-to-be failed states that "The USA doesn't pay for failure."

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/02/26 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: alcoholidaybbs.com / Est. 1995 / Columbia, SC (1:123/525)
  • From Aaron Thomas@1:123/525 to Gerhard Strangar on Thu Apr 6 21:37:47 2023
    "president of Ukraine," but Ukraine is no longer in service.
    Which day was the last one?
    The day that the television star/president allowed Russia to kill civilians. That was the END of Ukraine.

    Name a date.

    Approximately February 24, 2022 <- whenever it was that the civilians started dying.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/02/26 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: alcoholidaybbs.com / Est. 1995 / Columbia, SC (1:123/525)
  • From Aaron Thomas@1:123/525 to Gerhard Strangar on Thu Apr 6 21:42:59 2023
    Joe could have stopped the war but he refused to negotiate with Putin.

    He's not authorized to negotiate about Ukrainian territory.

    Zelensky failed, and Joe Biden doubles-down on failure.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/02/26 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: alcoholidaybbs.com / Est. 1995 / Columbia, SC (1:123/525)
  • From Dale Shipp@1:261/1466 to Aaron Thomas on Fri Apr 7 00:20:04 2023
    On 04-06-23 21:08, Aaron Thomas <=-
    spoke to Alan Ianson about Re: Who's at war <=-

    That's what I'm saying. Why does their president make them resort to
    such desperation? Would you still support Trudeau if he left you
    with no lube and a whole Russian army to make love to? This
    is why I no longer support Zelensky because he represents a
    very different type of democracy than the kind that we
    enforce in the states.

    You are right. He represents the type of democracy that helped to form
    the United States.

    Dale Shipp
    fido_261_1466 (at) verizon (dot) net
    (1:261/1466)


    ... Shipwrecked in Silver Spring, Maryland. 00:21:56, 07 Apr 2022
    ___ Blue Wave/DOS v2.30

    --- Maximus/NT 3.01
    * Origin: Owl's Anchor (1:261/1466)
  • From Gregory Deyss@1:267/150 to Alan Ianson on Fri Apr 7 01:50:38 2023
    I know he is running, or planning to run. I don't know who the next president wil be but I don't think it will be Donald Trump.
    The polls would suggest otherwise.

    I wasn't complaining. I stated the obvious fact that Donald Trump is a liar. Nothing more nothing less.
    This is nothing more than your opinion, but you have not stated any FACT based evidence. All that is conclusive is that you have TDS.

    .______ Ŀ Ŀ Ŀ Ŀ ͻ Ŀ
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    ... Condense soup, not books!

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    * Origin: Capital Station BBS * Telnet://csbbs.dyndns.org * (1:267/150)
  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Aaron Thomas on Thu Apr 6 23:47:24 2023
    The White House (that includes Joe) has been negotiating with Russia to
    stop the war but as you must know Russia has other plans.

    That sounds like a happy ending to a fairy tale, but for some reason, I've never heard news of such meetings. But if I start believing in them, will that make them exist?

    These discussions have happened but Russia wanted and continues the war.

    Nobody (except of course, Russia) wants the war. Many countries have tried to reason with Russia, even China!

    The war in Ukraine is not the fault of The White House, or Joe.

    --- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-6
    * Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757)
  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Aaron Thomas on Fri Apr 7 00:00:12 2023
    The people of Ukraine must defend themselves with whatever they have
    since the invasion of Russia.

    That's what I'm saying. Why does their president make them resort to such desperation? Would you still support Trudeau if he left you with no lube and a whole Russian army to make love to?

    Their president doesn't make them. They were attacked and are under attack by Russia. Russia is the evil does here. Not Joe, not Zelenski.

    Why do you support Russia in their war?

    This is why I no longer support Zelensky because he represents a very different type of democracy than the kind that we enforce in the states.

    Do you have a democracy in the states or are you enforcing something?

    Zelenski is more than that now. Much more.

    Yea, now he's made it to elite status. We should be congratulating him.

    You have a strange definition of "elite".

    I don't think so. Even a republican president would support Ukraine. Not
    the MAGA sort I understand, but a republican would. You know, a man who
    stands for America.

    Ukraine has nothing to do with America. America was established in 1776, Ukraine in the late 1990s.

    Ukraine is an ally.

    Why defend them so much? Why do you trust them so much?

    I would defend Poland or any other country attacked by an aggressor like Russia
    wherever it happened.

    Why do you stand with/for Russia the way you do?

    --- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-6
    * Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757)
  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Gregory Deyss on Fri Apr 7 00:08:02 2023
    The polls would suggest otherwise.

    Those are republican polls, not a poll of the general public.

    I wasn't complaining. I stated the obvious fact that Donald Trump is a
    liar. Nothing more nothing less.
    This is nothing more than your opinion, but you have not stated any FACT based evidence. All that is conclusive is that you have TDS.

    I couldn't really care less about Donald Trump. He's pretty much all washed up now. I worry more about the MAGA types than Ol' Donny.

    Do you actually believe that Donald Trump is an honest man after all we have seen and experienced these past few years?

    Every speech he makes includes more lies, there doesn't seem to be an end to it.

    --- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-6
    * Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757)
  • From Gregory Deyss@1:267/150 to Alan Ianson on Fri Apr 7 07:46:03 2023
    I couldn't really care less about Donald Trump. He's pretty much all washed up now. I worry more about the MAGA types than Ol' Donny.

    Do you actually believe that Donald Trump is an honest man after all we have seen and experienced these past few years?

    Why would a dishonest man, not collect any salary?

    Every speech he makes includes more lies, there doesn't seem to be an
    end to it.

    For someone who using your words "I couldn't really care less about Donald Trump" and yet you seem to be aware of he speeches which also seems to indicate
    you watch his rallies. Surely you do OR I mean if your going to call someone a lair, without any fact based evidence or context.
    Then it is as I say (a baseless accusation.)

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  • From Aaron Thomas@1:123/525 to Dale Shipp on Fri Apr 7 15:38:40 2023
    is why I no longer support Zelensky because he represents a
    very different type of democracy than the kind that we
    enforce in the states.

    You are right. He represents the type of democracy that helped to form the United States.

    Slavery is the type of labor that formed the United States. It doesn't mean that it was right.

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  • From Aaron Thomas@1:123/525 to Alan Ianson on Fri Apr 7 15:55:20 2023
    Their president doesn't make them. They were attacked and are under
    attack by Russia. Russia is the evil does here. Not Joe, not Zelenski.

    Why do you support Russia in their war?

    "Fighting Age" men, aged 18-60, are not allowed to leave Ukraine. The reason, is because they're expected to "fight." Maybe it's not Zelensky's law, but he's
    enforcing it.

    I don't support Russia nor Ukraine. Let them support themselves. But I also don't support forcing all men ages 18-60 to defend their homes from the Russian
    army with sticks and stones.

    This is why I no longer support Zelensky because he represents a very different type of democracy than the kind that we enforce in the states.

    Do you have a democracy in the states or are you enforcing something?

    If Biden tried to make American civilians fight the Russian army, he'd get voted out of office. We have a good democracy, because so far we haven't been forced to use 7th grade karate skills on the Russian army.

    Ukraine is an ally.

    To who? They ain't helping us with anything. Where were they when we were in Afghanistan? The Statue of Liberty - was that a gift from Ukraine?

    Why do you stand with/for Russia the way you do?

    Putin claimed that Ukraine has a bioweapons laboratory. How do we know he's lying? All we know is what we hear on TV. I don't "stand with Russia" just yet but if the bioweapons story turns out to be true, then I will totally stand with Russia.

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  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Gregory Deyss on Fri Apr 7 21:16:30 2023
    Do you actually believe that Donald Trump is an honest man after all we
    have seen and experienced these past few years?

    Why would a dishonest man, not collect any salary?

    Oh, Donald Trump collected. He is still asking his supporters to donate.

    Do you actually believe that Donald Trump is an honset man after all we have seen and experienced these past few years?

    For someone who using your words "I couldn't really care less about Donald Trump" and yet you seem to be aware of he speeches which also seems to indicate you watch his rallies. Surely you do OR I mean if your going to call someone a lair, without any fact based evidence or context.
    Then it is as I say (a baseless accusation.)

    I call Donald Trump a liar because that is what he is, that is what he has proven to be.

    It's you that talks about Donals Trump, not me.

    I am only saying that the man is a liar.

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  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Aaron Thomas on Fri Apr 7 21:23:20 2023
    Why do you support Russia in their war?

    "Fighting Age" men, aged 18-60, are not allowed to leave Ukraine. The reason, is because they're expected to "fight." Maybe it's not Zelensky's law, but he's enforcing it.

    They have to fight because they are being attacked not because of Zelensky.

    I don't support Russia nor Ukraine. Let them support themselves. But I also don't support forcing all men ages 18-60 to defend their homes from the Russia army with sticks and stones.

    The people of Ukraine defend themselves because they are under attack from Russia.

    Do you have a democracy in the states or are you enforcing something?

    If Biden tried to make American civilians fight the Russian army, he'd get voted out of office. We have a good democracy, because so far we haven't been forced to use 7th grade karate skills on the Russian army.

    America is not under attack and if it was you'd have to fight too, or run.

    Why do you stand with/for Russia the way you do?

    Putin claimed that Ukraine has a bioweapons laboratory. How do we know he's lying? All we know is what we hear on TV. I don't "stand with Russia" just yet but if the bioweapons story turns out to be true, then I will totally stand with Russia.

    What a silly story. You are already standing with Russia.

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  • From Dale Shipp@1:261/1466 to Aaron Thomas on Sat Apr 8 00:27:02 2023
    On 04-07-23 15:38, Aaron Thomas <=-
    spoke to Dale Shipp about Re: Who's at war <=-


    is why I no longer support Zelensky because he represents a
    very different type of democracy than the kind that we
    enforce in the states.

    You are right. He represents the type of democracy that helped to form the United States.

    Slavery is the type of labor that formed the United States.
    It doesn't mean that it was right.

    Slavery did help build the USA and it was not right. But I am talking
    about those who defied the odds and fought against oppression by another
    power, i.e. Washington et al.

    Dale Shipp
    fido_261_1466 (at) verizon (dot) net
    (1:261/1466)



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  • From Gregory Deyss@1:267/150 to Alan Ianson on Sat Apr 8 11:04:14 2023

    On 07 Apr 2023, Alan Ianson said the following...

    Do you actually believe that Donald Trump is an honest man after all we >> have seen and experienced these past few years?

    Why would a dishonest man, not collect any salary?
    Clearly when he was the President - he was not collecting a salary.
    Instead of trying to twist this FACT of which everyone know.


    Oh, Donald Trump collected. He is still asking his supporters to donate.
    So what, there is absolutely nothing wrong or "queer" about that.

    Do you actually believe that Donald Trump is an honset man after all we have seen and experienced these past few years?
    If that is the route that you wish to take, ok?
    What your suggesting is that "due to all that we have seen and experienced" Let's take a deeper dive into that specifically way beyond your assuming gaze.

    Nice try.. btw your attempting to do exactly the same thing as Alvin Bragg, by bringing 34 charges. This was done with deliberate intention to provide the shock and awe necessary, to make someone like you think or say out-loud
    "oh my word, he is really in a fix now..(Trump) is sooo screwed."
    Bragg is a moron and Soro's backed.
    (Since 2009, Soros' Open Society Foundation (OSF) has given $550,000 to Color of Change and its parent organization, Citizen Engagement Laboratory (CEL).
    The judge on the case has donated funds to Biden and even the judges own daughter has worked for the Kamala Harris. All true..

    Lets go deeper still, after two impeachments and two ACQUITTALS, A fake Russian
    dossier + A Robert Mueller investigation (surrounded by 13 democrats on his team) that costed nearly 32 million dollars. If that is not enough then there was the recent events at the (above mentioned) Southern District of New York with Alvin "Cheeseburger" Bragg, who will be very shortly of being disgraced due there is no there.. there..
    Here is why Alvin's Braggs charges will not matter in the end.
    1 He campaigned to get Trump. along with the same POS of the same race
    Letitia James, the AG here in Albany, New York of the same mindset.
    2. statute of limitations time limit
    1a even if they were within statute of limitations, these would of been Misdemeanors at best.
    3. The indictment speaks of a "Another Crime" that is left unspecified.
    * I know nothing as to how the law works in Canada, but here in the U.S. the accused have the right to be told what they are accused of this is called Notice of accusation: A criminal defendant has the right to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation against him.

    Donald John Trump is still standing, which would clearly demonstrate that he
    is a fighter, these things would devastate and end anyone else.

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  • From Gerhard Strangar@2:240/2188.575 to Aaron Thomas on Sat Apr 8 10:54:14 2023
    Am 06 Apr 23 21:33:06 schrob Aaron Thomas an Gerhard Strangar zum Thema
    <Re: Who's at war>

    I wanted to know what your option C was. What's your strategy?
    We should depose failed leader Zelensky and then negotiate a transition
    to Russia plan for the surviving colonists.

    Who is "we", why would the people of Ukraine accept whatever the result of the negotiations are and who do you want to negotiate with?

    Then give a warning to other
    soon-to-be failed states that "The USA doesn't pay for failure."

    In 1994 Russia, the USA and the UK convinced Kazakhstan, Belarus and Ukraine to
    hand over the nuclear weapons and in return get protection from these countries. Maybe you also want to give out the warning that the USA don't care about what negotiation results they signed. Moreover, all "soon-to-be failed states" would need nuclear weapons in your world.



    Tschoe mit Oe
    Gerhard
    ---
    * Origin: (2:240/2188.575)
  • From Gerhard Strangar@2:240/2188.575 to Aaron Thomas on Sat Apr 8 11:03:48 2023
    Am 06 Apr 23 21:37:47 schrob Aaron Thomas an Gerhard Strangar zum Thema
    <Re: Who's at war>

    "president of Ukraine," but Ukraine is no longer in
    service. GS>> Which day was the last one?
    The day that the television star/president allowed Russia to
    kill AT> civilians. That was the END of Ukraine.
    Name a date.
    Approximately February 24, 2022 <- whenever it was that the civilians started dying.

    Civilians started dying when Russia occupied Crimea in 2014.



    Tschoe mit Oe
    Gerhard
    ---
    * Origin: (2:240/2188.575)
  • From Gerhard Strangar@2:240/2188.575 to Aaron Thomas on Sat Apr 8 16:44:39 2023
    Ukraine has nothing to do with America. America was established in 1776, Ukraine in the late 1990s.

    If Ukraine did not exist in 1954, Crimea was given to which entity? Moreover, the USSR ceased to exist in 1991, which is not "late 1990s", it's the first year of the 1990s.



    Tschoe mit Oe
    Gerhard
    ---
    * Origin: (2:240/2188.575)
  • From Gerhard Strangar@2:240/2188.575 to Aaron Thomas on Sat Apr 8 17:01:21 2023
    Am 07 Apr 23 15:55:20 schrob Aaron Thomas an Alan Ianson zum Thema
    <Re: Who's at war>

    To who? They ain't helping us with anything. Where were they when we
    were in Afghanistan?

    They were there, too. And everyone knows that.

    https://www.mil.gov.ua/news/2014/09/17/rozpochato-chergovu-%E2%80%93-8-rotacziyu-%E2%80%93-ukrainskogo-kontingentu/

    The headline is "The 8th rotation of the Ukrainian contingent of the International Security Assistance Force in Afghanistan has been launched".



    Tschoe mit Oe
    Gerhard
    ---
    * Origin: (2:240/2188.575)
  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Gregory Deyss on Sat Apr 8 13:54:24 2023
    Why would a dishonest man, not collect any salary?
    Clearly when he was the President - he was not collecting a salary.
    Instead of trying to twist this FACT of which everyone know.

    He did collect/receive his salary, today he collects a pension.

    In the first three years of his predency he donated his salary to various causes but he did in fact recieve his salary.

    Oh, Donald Trump collected. He is still asking his supporters to donate.
    So what, there is absolutely nothing wrong or "queer" about that.

    It is a scam.

    Do you actually believe that Donald Trump is an honset man after all we
    have seen and experienced these past few years?
    If that is the route that you wish to take, ok?
    What your suggesting is that "due to all that we have seen and experienced" Let's take a deeper dive into that specifically way beyond your assuming gaze.

    This should be good.

    Nice try.. btw your attempting to do exactly the same thing as Alvin Bragg, by bringing 34 charges. This was done with deliberate intention to provide the shock and awe necessary, to make someone like you think or say out-loud "oh my word, he is really in a fix now..(Trump) is sooo screwed."

    Nothing I have said relates to Alvin Bragg or the indictments Donald Trump is now facing.

    What shock and awe? Are you surprised that Donald Trump has been indicted? That's normal when law and order is upheld.

    If you do a crime in a country where law and order is the norm you will be charged and face a judge or jury.

    Donald Trumps legal challenges have just begun, there is also the matter of stolen documents and his attempt to steal the 2022 election and the events of Jan 6.

    Now of that is likely to be swept under the rug in a society of law and order.

    Bragg is a moron and Soro's backed. (Since 2009, Soros' Open Society Foundation (OSF) has given $550,000 to Color of Change and its parent organization, Citizen Engagement Laboratory (CEL).

    I don't know what the Open Society Foundation goals are but I don't find George
    Soros, OSF or Color of Change to be any kind of threat.

    Donald Trump might.

    The judge on the case has donated funds to Biden and even the judges own daughter has worked for the Kamala Harris. All true..

    It might be, but there is nothing wrong with donating to Biden or the judges daughter working for Kamala Harris.

    Unless it is some sort of conspiracy. Is that what you are suggesting?

    Lets go deeper still, after two impeachments and two ACQUITTALS, A fake Russia dossier + A Robert Mueller investigation (surrounded by 13 democrats on his team) that costed nearly 32 million dollars. If that is not enough then there was the recent events at the (above mentioned) Southern District of New York with Alvin "Cheeseburger" Bragg, who will be very shortly of being disgraced due there is no there.. there..

    The impeachment of Donald Trump, both of them, were brought for very good reasons. Trump was not acquitted, he never went to trial.

    The reason Trump did not face justice at that time is another matter altogether.

    The Russia dossier (as you call it) is another cause for concern.

    Donald Trump was not cleared by the Mueller investigation. He was not charged because he was a sitting president.

    Here is why Alvin's Braggs charges will not matter in the end.

    I agree, I am not really interested in the Stormy Daniels affair but she was paid to keep quite, we know this. Donald Trump did commit a crime there and if he is convicted of those charges he will face justice.

    I am more interested in the upcoming cases around his election lies and the stolen documents.

    It is my hope that justice will be served in those case.

    1 He campaigned to get Trump. along with the same POS of the same race Letitia James, the AG here in Albany, New York of the same mindset.
    2. statute of limitations time limit
    1a even if they were within statute of limitations, these would of been Misdemeanors at best.
    3. The indictment speaks of a "Another Crime" that is left unspecified.
    * I know nothing as to how the law works in Canada, but here in the U.S.
    the accused have the right to be told what they are accused of this is
    called Notice of accusation: A criminal defendant has the right to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation against him.

    Paying someone for their silence is one thing, writing the cost off on your taxes is something else.

    Donald John Trump is still standing, which would clearly demonstrate that he is a fighter, these things would devastate and end anyone else.

    The fact that Donald Trump is a fighter is fine, it's the way he fights and what he fights for that I don't care for.

    The Donald Trump era is a sad part of American history.

    --- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-6
    * Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757)
  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Gregory Deyss on Sat Apr 8 17:25:08 2023
    Do you actually believe that Donald Trump is an honset man after all we
    have seen and experienced these past few years?
    If that is the route that you wish to take, ok?
    What your suggesting is that "due to all that we have seen and experienced"
    Let's take a deeper dive into that specifically way beyond your assuming gaze.

    Here's a quick smattering of recent (after his arrest) lies.

    https://youtu.be/DTBOL4UUFWI

    This is why I say that Donald Trump is a liar. I am being generous.

    --- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-6
    * Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757)
  • From Gregory Deyss@1:267/150 to Alan Ianson on Sat Apr 8 20:44:50 2023
    On 08 Apr 2023, Alan Ianson said the following...

    Nothing I have said relates to Alvin Bragg or the indictments Donald
    Trump is now facing.

    It's oddly similar to what you have stated "Donald Trump is an dishonest man after all we have seen and experienced these past few years?" now lets compare this to what Alvin Bragg is attempting to do with these 34 charges to a underlining crime of which has NOT as yet been defined or explained.
    Both Bragg and yourself are suggesting nearly the same. There may be some differences but both share an uncanny speculation and to the assumption of guilt. When the real story is that what he is being charged with has not only ran out of gas as the statue of limitations has expired, there are no tax issues or other issues with financials either, the Feds have already looked at that angle within the Mueller probe.

    Donald Trump responds
    Trump pointedly noted that Mueller, I assume, for $35 million, checked my taxes, checked my financials. They checked my financials, and they checked my taxes, I assume the inference being that since Mueller had looked at them, there is no need for Congress to review them also.

    Charging someone 34 times or even more then twice is meant to be a form of intimidation. What you seem to think and is quite obvious is that Trump is a liar simply because what has been viewed through the lens of a liberal eyes, with your over the years comment. You are not looking at this logically and not
    only it is without logic it is done so with a broad brush w/ largely making assumptions, because it is enough to convince the narrative that is clearly far
    left.

    The judge on the case has donated funds to Biden and even the judges own daughter has worked for the Kamala Harris. All true..

    It might be, but there is nothing wrong with donating to Biden or the judges daughter working for Kamala Harris.

    Unless it is some sort of conspiracy. Is that what you are suggesting?

    Merchan, the judge overseeing the case that had Trump indicted over the payment
    of hush money to adult film star Stormy Daniels during his 2016 presidential campaign, has a 34-year-old daughter, Loren, who has a history of working for Democratic politicians including Vice President Kamala Harris and California Representative Adam Schiff.

    Merchan has donated to the onetime and potential future political opponent of a
    defendant now facing a trial in his courtroom.

    The donations are likely to continue to fuel Trump's criticism of the judge and
    his family, whom he has accused of being biased against him (Trump and his family have also criticized Merchan's daughter for her work for then-Sen. Kamala Harris's presidential bid and subsequently for the Biden-Harris presidential ticket).

    The donations were unwise as a matter of appearance, said Chuck Rosenberg, an NBC News legal analyst and a former federal prosecutor.
    But appearances matter.

    The fact that Donald Trump is a fighter is fine, it's the way he fights
    and what he fights for that I don't care for.
    I have no issue with the bluntness or how he talks, many Americans often say he
    is talking the way I am thinking, which is why he was and still is popular and loved by so many people.

    The Donald Trump era is a sad part of American history.
    You are of course entitled to your opinion.
    USMCA.. Yeah, that was Trump who did that, perhaps this is what I mean, when I say you don't look deep enough before putting yourself out there just another person with Trump Derangement Syndrome.
    This is what you get when you only read the headlines and not the story.

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  • From Gregory Deyss@1:267/150 to Alan Ianson on Sat Apr 8 20:53:27 2023
    On 08 Apr 2023, Alan Ianson said the following...

    Do you actually believe that Donald Trump is an honset man after all we >> have seen and experienced these past few years?
    If that is the route that you wish to take, ok?
    What your suggesting is that "due to all that we have seen and
    experience
    Let's take a deeper dive into that specifically way beyond your assuming
    g

    Here's a quick smattering of recent (after his arrest) lies.

    https://youtu.be/DTBOL4UUFWI
    Really Alan? It's CNN they have been caught many times twisting the truth and this has caused them to loose creditability.
    Perhaps, this is why Cartoon Network has higher ratings then CNN.

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  • From Aaron Thomas@1:123/525 to Alan Ianson on Sat Apr 8 22:19:30 2023
    They have to fight because they are being attacked not because of Zelensky.

    Their government failed them bigtime.

    America is not under attack and if it was you'd have to fight too, or
    run.

    But the government can't stop me from running. That's how the USA differs from Ukraine.

    What a silly story. You are already standing with Russia.

    The bioweapons story isn't silly. You already know that covid is real.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/02/26 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: alcoholidaybbs.com / Est. 1995 / Columbia, SC (1:123/525)
  • From Aaron Thomas@1:123/525 to Dale Shipp on Sat Apr 8 22:22:06 2023
    You are right. He represents the type of democracy that helped to
    fo
    the United States.

    Slavery is the type of labor that formed the United States.
    It doesn't mean that it was right.

    Slavery did help build the USA and it was not right. But I am talking about those who defied the odds and fought against oppression by another power, i.e. Washington et al.

    The similarity of their war to ours doesn't mean that it's logical to fund theirs into oblivion.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/02/26 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: alcoholidaybbs.com / Est. 1995 / Columbia, SC (1:123/525)
  • From Aaron Thomas@1:123/525 to Gerhard Strangar on Sat Apr 8 22:45:12 2023
    We should depose failed leader Zelensky and then negotiate a GS> AT>
    transitio
    to Russia plan for the surviving colonists.

    Who is "we", why would the people of Ukraine accept whatever the result
    of the negotiations are and who do you want to negotiate with?

    We as in the USA. Zelensky's war is financed by our nipple. If they want to suck out any more milk, then they'd better do exactly what our leaders say and let us call all the shots moving forward.

    In 1994 Russia, the USA and the UK convinced Kazakhstan, Belarus and Ukraine to hand over the nuclear weapons and in return get protection
    from these countries. Maybe you also want to give out the warning that
    the USA don't care about what negotiation results they signed. Moreover, all "soon-to-be failed states" would need nuclear weapons in your world.

    That explains why they may have invested in bio weapons. Surely if that's the case, then Biden will do anything to keep it covered up.

    What's meant by "protection?" Does that mean borrowing as much money as our credit will take us, into an oblivion of debt, to fund a war that nobody ever even tried to negotiate us out of?

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/02/26 (Linux/64)
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  • From Aaron Thomas@1:123/525 to Gerhard Strangar on Sat Apr 8 22:45:52 2023
    Approximately February 24, 2022 <- whenever it was that the civilians

    started dying.

    Civilians started dying when Russia occupied Crimea in 2014.

    It's hard to tell who's responsible for more Ukrainian deaths, Obama or Biden. Probably Biden though!

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/02/26 (Linux/64)
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  • From Aaron Thomas@1:123/525 to Gerhard Strangar on Sat Apr 8 22:47:17 2023
    The headline is "The 8th rotation of the Ukrainian contingent of the International Security Assistance Force in Afghanistan has been
    launched".

    Show me the headline that says "United States will pay Ukraine's way out of anything?"

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A49 2023/02/26 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: alcoholidaybbs.com / Est. 1995 / Columbia, SC (1:123/525)
  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Gregory Deyss on Sat Apr 8 19:57:28 2023
    Nothing I have said relates to Alvin Bragg or the indictments Donald
    Trump is now facing.

    It's oddly similar to what you have stated "Donald Trump is an dishonest man after all we have seen and experienced these past few years?" now lets compare this to what Alvin Bragg is attempting to do with these 34 charges
    to a underlining crime of which has NOT as yet been defined or explained.

    Yes, when I say that I am not talking about Bragg ot the charges he has laid.

    Donald Trump responds
    Trump pointedly noted that Mueller, I assume, for $35 million, checked my taxes, checked my financials. They checked my financials, and they checked my taxes, I assume the inference being that since Mueller had looked at them, there is no need for Congress to review them also.

    The Mueller investigation did not exonerate Trump in any way. You must know that.

    Charging someone 34 times or even more then twice is meant to be a form of intimidation. What you seem to think and is quite obvious is that Trump is a liar simply because what has been viewed through the lens of a liberal eyes, with your over the years comment. You are not looking at this logically and not only it is without logic it is done so with a broad brush w/ largely making assumptions, because it is enough to convince the narrative that is clearly far left.

    Bragg is a prosecutor. When someone commits a crimes(s) the prosecutor may lay charges. That is where we are. There is nothing to be surprised about.

    A judge or jury will decide guilt or innocence based on the evidence provided to them in court.

    The judge on the case has donated funds to Biden and even the judges own >> > daughter has worked for the Kamala Harris. All true..

    It might be, but there is nothing wrong with donating to Biden or the
    judges daughter working for Kamala Harris.

    Unless it is some sort of conspiracy. Is that what you are suggesting?

    Merchan, the judge overseeing the case that had Trump indicted over the payment of hush money to adult film star Stormy Daniels during his 2016 presidential campaign, has a 34-year-old daughter, Loren, who has a history of working for Democratic politicians including Vice President Kamala Harris and California Representative Adam Schiff.

    Is there a crime by the judge or his daughter in any of the above?

    Merchan has donated to the onetime and potential future political opponent
    of defendant now facing a trial in his courtroom.

    The donations are likely to continue to fuel Trump's criticism of the judge and his family, whom he has accused of being biased against him (Trump and his family have also criticized Merchan's daughter for her work for then-Sen. Kamala Harris's presidential bid and subsequently for the Biden-Harris presidential ticket).

    I guess Trump only likes donations when they are headed his way.

    The donations were unwise as a matter of appearance, said Chuck Rosenberg, an NBC News legal analyst and a former federal prosecutor.
    But appearances matter.

    There is no crime in these donations and there is no crime in "working for Democartat" politicians.

    The Donald Trump era is a sad part of American history.
    You are of course entitled to your opinion.
    USMCA.. Yeah, that was Trump who did that, perhaps this is what I mean, when

    Trump did nothing. Why do you bring up USMCA?

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  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Gregory Deyss on Sat Apr 8 19:59:16 2023
    Here's a quick smattering of recent (after his arrest) lies.

    https://youtu.be/DTBOL4UUFWI
    Really Alan? It's CNN they have been caught many times twisting the truth and this has caused them to loose creditability.
    Perhaps, this is why Cartoon Network has higher ratings then CNN.

    I agree with you about CNN, but this fact checker does a good job of dismantling Trumps lies.

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  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Aaron Thomas on Sat Apr 8 20:02:24 2023
    They have to fight because they are being attacked not because of
    Zelensky.

    Their government failed them bigtime.

    Ukrainians support Zelensky. Bigtime.

    America is not under attack and if it was you'd have to fight too, or
    run.

    But the government can't stop me from running. That's how the USA differs from Ukraine.

    Sure, fight or run, it's your choice.

    What a silly story. You are already standing with Russia.

    The bioweapons story isn't silly. You already know that covid is real.

    Bioweapons, covid? What's next?

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    * Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757)
  • From hollow one@1:105/420 to Aaron Thomas on Sat Apr 8 13:21:56 2023
    There was no need to spill any Ukranian civilian blood. It all could
    have been averted, but Democrats..

    Yeah, right... like if siting on a sofa, watching FOX TV, 15k miles away makes any influence on anything by just one subjective force that articulates something to stimulate local masses to vote.

    We're talking about global events and changing eras of influence that I believe
    are triggered regardless of the Washington DC seats setup.

    Following Trump's ignorance toward Russia would not save Ukraine to be test ground for:
    - how much NATO fails to carry on its mission across both sides of Atlantic
    - how much EU is just a consumer of Chinese goods and cares about nothing else in the world
    - how much US can actually influence EU to stay in tact or it's fucking left alone militarily (see how this argument changed FR/DE against their own political will and goals, and how much they are still confused and try to talk to both fronts of the same political discussion, like Macron now in Beijing, proving they still want to maintain a consumer role)

    and many more hows.. that regardless if Democrats or Republicans have to deal with it.. sooner or later had to be dealt with.. somehow.

    Trump's politics would only continue a road toward isolationism that perhaps is
    popular, considering domestic challenges... but would end up exactly like it did 80 years earlier.. with Chinese (, not Japanese) Pearl Harbor by 2030.. which I still believe may be really difficult to avoid in another Pacific campaign, unless this another cold war with some blood spoiled on Ukrainian soil is spend..

    And they want it too... as this is their dream now to release themselves from Russian boot.

    Outcome still unknown.

    -h1

    ... Xerox Alto was the thing. Anything after we use is just a copy.

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  • From Gerhard Strangar@2:240/2188.575 to Aaron Thomas on Sun Apr 9 14:16:51 2023
    Am 08 Apr 23 22:45:12 schrob Aaron Thomas an Gerhard Strangar zum Thema
    <Re: Who's at war>

    What's meant by "protection?"

    Territorial integrity.



    Tschoe mit Oe
    Gerhard
    ---
    * Origin: (2:240/2188.575)
  • From Gerhard Strangar@2:240/2188.575 to Aaron Thomas on Sun Apr 9 14:26:38 2023
    Am 08 Apr 23 22:47:17 schrob Aaron Thomas an Gerhard Strangar zum Thema
    <Re: Who's at war>

    The headline is "The 8th rotation of the Ukrainian contingent of the
    International Security Assistance Force in Afghanistan has been
    launched".
    Show me the headline that says "United States will pay Ukraine's way out of anything?"

    No offense, but it's 2023. If you still don't know how to use a search engine to get some facts, let's end this conversation.



    Tschoe mit Oe
    Gerhard
    ---
    * Origin: (2:240/2188.575)
  • From Gregory Deyss@1:267/150 to Alan Ianson on Sun Apr 9 08:54:11 2023
    On 08 Apr 2023, Alan Ianson said the following...

    The Mueller investigation did not exonerate Trump in any way. You must know that.
    *You* Who only read the headlines, need to better informed.

    Mr. Mueller, who spent nearly two years investigating Moscow's determined effort to sabotage the last presidential election, found no conspiracy despite multiple offers from Russian-affiliated individuals to assist the Trump campaign, Mr. Barr wrote in a letter to lawmakers.

    Mr. Mueller's team drew no conclusions about whether Mr. Trump illegally obstructed justice, Mr. Barr said, so he made his own decision. The attorney general and his deputy, Rod J. Rosenstein, determined that the special counsel's investigators had insufficient evidence to establish that the president committed that offense.

    Additionally...
    Still, the release of the findings was a significant political victory for Mr. Trump and lifted a cloud that has hung over his presidency since before he took
    the oath of office.

    You may choose to read more here https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/24/us/politics/mueller-report-summary.html

    Bragg is a prosecutor. When someone commits a crimes(s) the prosecutor
    may lay charges. That is where we are. There is nothing to be surprised about.
    Charges? What charges. the time limit has expired therefore there is no case. As far as the other crime that Bragg spoke about he has yet to indicate or define what the hell he is talking about as it is still undermined..

    Have you read about Bragg?
    If you did you would know that he is really soft on real crime with thugs of his same race, heinous and quite disgusting acts. Making deals with thugs who just commit ever more vile acts. Yet again your mis-informed.

    I guess Trump only likes donations when they are headed his way.
    It's not a conspiracy it's optics here you have a judge who with his own actions of support of the a political rival. A judge uses facts they are not allowed to use their personal feelings and then use them to vilify the person sitting in their court room. This is what happens in a banana republic.

    The donations were unwise as a matter of appearance, said Chuck
    Rosenberg
    NBC News legal analyst and a former federal prosecutor.
    But appearances matter.

    There is no crime in these donations and there is no crime in "working
    for Democartat" politicians.
    Crime no but it is questionable and this is why the case will be moved or the case gets dropped altogether.

    The Donald Trump era is a sad part of American history.
    You are of course entitled to your opinion.
    USMCA.. Yeah, that was Trump who did that, perhaps this is what I mean,
    w

    Trump did nothing. Why do you bring up USMCA?
    The USMCA was created under Trump and it supports both of our countries + Mexico. The reason why I brought up should be obvious, you said Trump did nothing, this is not true. As I just pointed out.

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  • From Gregory Deyss@1:267/150 to Alan Ianson on Sun Apr 9 10:27:52 2023
    On 08 Apr 2023, Alan Ianson said the following...

    Here's a quick smattering of recent (after his arrest) lies.

    https://youtu.be/DTBOL4UUFWI
    Really Alan? It's CNN they have been caught many times twisting the
    truth
    this has caused them to loose creditability.
    Perhaps, this is why Cartoon Network has higher ratings then CNN.

    I agree with you about CNN, but this fact checker does a good job of dismantling Trumps lies.

    A good job? because you sallow what he is spitting?
    As you sit there and watch this segment and even nod along (I have no doubt) at
    every vile senseless sentence, perhaps a "Yup" escapes your mouth?
    This guy who is talking to Anderson Cooper wearing the maroon tie is a political hack and it's airing on CNN. Anderson Cooper sits there as he listens
    with a look of *fake* concern upon his face, it's all an act and yet you digest
    this garbage. You would get the same fake broadcast if you tunned in to watch Rachel Maddow on MSNBC.

    Both CNN and MSNBC have been found many times to be inaccurate.
    The ratings for both Networks are dismal and yet you consume such garbage because it fits your narrative. The future will show just how wrong they have been.

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  • From Dale Shipp@1:261/1466 to Gregory Deyss on Sun Apr 9 15:09:06 2023
    On 04-08-23 11:04, Gregory Deyss <=-
    spoke to Alan Ianson about Re: Who's at war <=-

    Bragg is a moron and Soro's backed.
    (Since 2009, Soros' Open Society Foundation (OSF) has given
    $550,000 to Color of Change and its parent organization,
    Citizen Engagement Laboratory (CEL).

    How much of that went to Bragg personally?

    Compare that to the value of favors directly given to Supreme
    Court Justice Thomas by a conservative magnate?

    Lets go deeper still, after two impeachments and two ACQUITTALS, A
    fake Russian dossier + A Robert Mueller investigation
    (surrounded by 13 democrats on his team) that costed nearly
    32 million dollars.

    I remind you again that the Mueller investigation turned a net profit.

    Donald John Trump is still standing, which would clearly demonstrate
    that he is a fighter, these things would devastate and end anyone else.

    He may well not be standing for long, given potential charges against
    him in state and federal investigations still underway.

    Dale Shipp
    fido_261_1466 (at) verizon (dot) net
    (1:261/1466)


    ... Shipwrecked in Silver Spring, Maryland. 15:15:23, 09 Apr 2022
    ___ Blue Wave/DOS v2.30

    --- Maximus/NT 3.01
    * Origin: Owl's Anchor (1:261/1466)
  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Gregory Deyss on Sun Apr 9 13:29:14 2023
    https://youtu.be/DTBOL4UUFWI

    I agree with you about CNN, but this fact checker does a good job of
    dismantling Trumps lies.

    A good job? because you sallow what he is spitting?

    He speaks the truth.

    Trump never should have had those documents and he knows that.

    He could have given the documents back when asked but he did not.

    The FBI had to search his propery at Mara-a-Lago and when they searched the documents were found. There are still missing documents.

    As you sit there and watch this segment and even nod along (I have no doubt) a every vile senseless sentence, perhaps a "Yup" escapes your mouth?

    What vile senseless sentence?

    This guy who is talking to Anderson Cooper wearing the maroon tie is a political hack and it's airing on CNN. Anderson Cooper sits there as he listen with a look of *fake* concern upon his face, it's all an act and yet you diges this garbage. You would get the same fake broadcast if you tunned in to watch Rachel Maddow on MSNBC.

    Why do you bring up Rachel Maddow now?

    Both CNN and MSNBC have been found many times to be inaccurate.
    The ratings for both Networks are dismal and yet you consume such garbage because it fits your narrative. The future will show just how wrong they have been.

    What inaccuracies do you speak of?

    --- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-6
    * Origin: The Rusty MailBox - Penticton, BC Canada (1:153/757)
  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Gregory Deyss on Sun Apr 9 13:41:46 2023
    Mr. Mueller's team drew no conclusions about whether Mr. Trump illegally obstructed justice, Mr. Barr said, so he made his own decision. The attorney general and his deputy, Rod J. Rosenstein, determined that the special counsel's investigators had insufficient evidence to establish that the president committed that offense.

    They were never going to do that. Donald Trump was the sitting president at the
    time. The Mueller report does not exonerate Trump as you claim.

    https://youtu.be/PNvA59xeZhU

    Additionally...
    Still, the release of the findings was a significant political victory for Mr. Trump and lifted a cloud that has hung over his presidency since before he took the oath of office.

    It did no such thing.

    You may choose to read more here https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/24/us/politics/mueller-report-summary.html

    The headline says exactly what I am telling you.

    Bragg is a prosecutor. When someone commits a crimes(s) the prosecutor
    may lay charges. That is where we are. There is nothing to be surprised
    about.
    Charges? What charges.

    The 34 charges laid against him.

    the time limit has expired therefore there is no case. As far as the other crime that Bragg spoke about he has yet to indicate or define what the hell he is talking about as it is still undermined..

    The case will be laid out in court.

    Have you read about Bragg?

    I know nothing about Bragg.

    If you did you would know that he is really soft on real crime with thugs of his same race, heinous and quite disgusting acts. Making deals with thugs who just commit ever more vile acts. Yet again your mis-informed.

    Is this what Trumps defense will look like? That's all right wing spin.

    USMCA.. Yeah, that was Trump who did that, perhaps this is what I mean,

    Trump did nothing. Why do you bring up USMCA?

    The USMCA was created under Trump and it supports both of our countries + Mexico. The reason why I brought up should be obvious, you said Trump did nothing, this is not true. As I just pointed out.

    Trump did nothing. We were trading under Nafta for years before that.

    --- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-6
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  • From Gregory Deyss@1:267/150 to Dale Shipp on Sun Apr 9 18:25:52 2023
    On 09 Apr 2023, Dale Shipp said the following...

    On 04-08-23 11:04, Gregory Deyss <=-
    spoke to Alan Ianson about Re: Who's at war <=-

    Bragg is a moron and Soro's backed.
    (Since 2009, Soros' Open Society Foundation (OSF) has given
    $550,000 to Color of Change and its parent organization,
    Citizen Engagement Laboratory (CEL).
    well if it isn't Dale Shipp.
    You sure you want to get into this me :)
    Just figured I would be polite and ask...

    How much of that went to Bragg personally?
    I am not suggesting that ANY of this went to him personally, but it did sure get him elected it, Soros backed DA's and prosecutors need to banned as well as
    Soros himself needs to go and I do not care how. These people under the influence of Soros money and Soros himself is dangerous, and don't give me any of that goody two-shoes humanitarian crap, Soros is bad news today just as he was when he was young, cutting deals Nazi's with the gold harvested from dead jews to have his own ass sparred. He is a vile man.
    All true there is a video floating around with him indicating exactly this speaking to a younger Steve Croft https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OT1Qn6COp6Y&t=141s

    I remind you again that the Mueller investigation turned a net profit.

    It COULD but only by stealing from Paul Manafort. https://www.cnbc.com/2018/09/17/mueller-probe-could-turn-a-profit-thanks-to-man afort-assets.html


    Donald John Trump is still standing, which would clearly demonstrate that he is a fighter, these things would devastate and end anyone
    else

    He may well not be standing for long, given potential charges against
    him in state and federal investigations still underway.

    There is no case in Georgia, asking to find votes on a phone call is not wrong or criminal.

    The case here in New York will end in embarrassment for Bragg will he will a bigger laughing stock more so then he already is. Bragg will be disgraced.
    He should already be charges brought against him due to the deals with thugs only to be let free to commit more carnage.

    There is no case with classified documents either.

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  • From Gregory Deyss@1:267/150 to Alan Ianson on Sun Apr 9 21:38:03 2023
    On 09 Apr 2023, Alan Ianson said the following...

    https://youtu.be/DTBOL4UUFWI

    I agree with you about CNN, but this fact checker does a good job of
    dismantling Trumps lies.
    A good job? because you sallow what he is spitting?

    He speaks the truth.
    Not exactly or at all.
    It was John Adams who said the following
    "Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence".

    Presidential Records Act (PRA) of 1978
    Source: https://www.archives.gov/presidential-libraries/laws/1978-act.html
    One such provision states
    "Establishes in law that any incumbent Presidential records (whether textual
    or electronic) held on courtesy storage by the Archivist remain in the exclusive legal custody of the President and that any request or order for access to such records must be made to the President, not NARA."

    This guy who is talking to Anderson Cooper wearing the maroon tie is a political hack and it's airing on CNN. Anderson Cooper sits there as he listen with a look of *fake* concern upon his face, it's all an act and
    y
    you diges this garbage. You would get the same fake broadcast if you
    tunn
    in to watch Rachel Maddow on MSNBC.

    Why do you bring up Rachel Maddow now?
    she is cut from the same liberal cast as CNN is, why I mentioned should be obvious.

    Both CNN and MSNBC have been found many times to be inaccurate.
    The ratings for both Networks are dismal and yet you consume such
    garbage
    because it fits your narrative. The future will show just how wrong they

    been.

    What inaccuracies do you speak of?
    Far to many to mention, but the entire clip you shared from CNN it was done to deliberately twist truth it's CNN. These people live and dream for the day. Trump is what keeps them up at night, he lives rent free in their heads and apparently yours as well.

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  • From Gregory Deyss@1:267/150 to Alan Ianson on Sun Apr 9 22:30:23 2023
    They were never going to do that. Donald Trump was the sitting president at the time. The Mueller report does not exonerate Trump as you claim.

    https://youtu.be/PNvA59xeZhU
    and heres a better clip for you
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VijjacEjSkI

    Exoneration and for that matter Collusion are meaningless because they are not considered to be legal terms.

    Robert Mueller was a great man, but he was cognitive mess during the hearings, as he couldn't many aspects. It was painful to watch..
    and here another oh-oh moment.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EbrfiAxjY0
    and yet another
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ekQPGedzF_c

    Additionally...
    Still, the release of the findings was a significant political victory
    fo
    Mr. Trump and lifted a cloud that has hung over his presidency since
    befo
    he took the oath of office.

    It did no such thing.
    um that too is from the same New York Times Article which is liberal as you are.

    The case will be laid out in court.

    Have you read about Bragg?

    I know nothing about Bragg.
    You may want to check into Alvin Cheeseburger Bragg?

    If you did you would know that he is really soft on real crime with
    thugs
    his same race, heinous and quite disgusting acts. Making deals with
    thugs
    just commit ever more vile acts.
    All of the above is unfortunately true, but don't take my word for it, do your own research if you so inclined to do so.

    Is this what Trumps defense will look like? That's all right wing spin.
    I know nothing of Trumps legal team, it's common knowledge, and every word of it is true. Bragg is soft criminals it was really a bonehead move to have all the cops at the court house on that day along with what was a media circus, crime did happen on that day elsewhere in the city, it was a like a criminals Christmas.

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  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Gregory Deyss on Sun Apr 9 19:31:52 2023
    https://youtu.be/DTBOL4UUFWI

    I agree with you about CNN, but this fact checker does a good job of
    dismantling Trumps lies.
    A good job? because you sallow what he is spitting?

    He speaks the truth.
    Not exactly or at all.

    He did speak the truth, excatly. You don't seem to be interested in truth.

    It was John Adams who said the following
    "Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence".

    Yes, and the facts are in.

    Presidential Records Act (PRA) of 1978
    Source: https://www.archives.gov/presidential-libraries/laws/1978-act.html One such provision states
    "Establishes in law that any incumbent Presidential records (whether textual or electronic) held on courtesy storage by the Archivist remain in the exclusive legal custody of the President and that any request or order for access to such records must be made to the President, not NARA."

    And right below that is says this..

    Establishes that Presidential records automatically transfer into the legal custody of the Archivist as soon as the President leaves office.

    This is the issue.

    You would get the same fake broadcast if you tune in to watch Rachel
    Maddow on MSNBC.

    Why do you bring up Rachel Maddow now?
    she is cut from the same liberal cast as CNN is, why I mentioned should be obvious.

    We are discussing Donald Trump and presidential records, not Rachel Maddow!

    Far to many to mention, but the entire clip you shared from CNN it was done to deliberately twist truth it's CNN. These people live and dream for the day. Trump is what keeps them up at night, he lives rent free in their heads and apparently yours as well.

    It is you talking about Donald Trump, not me.

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  • From Dale Shipp@1:261/1466 to Gregory Deyss on Mon Apr 10 00:03:00 2023
    On 04-09-23 08:54, Gregory Deyss <=-
    spoke to Alan Ianson about Re: Who's at war <=-

    Mr. Mueller, who spent nearly two years investigating Moscow's
    determined effort to sabotage the last presidential election, found no conspiracy despite multiple offers from Russian-affiliated
    individuals to assist the Trump campaign, Mr. Barr wrote in
    a letter to lawmakers.

    True. The Mueller report found multiple occurrences of cooperation, but
    did not find sufficient evidence to warrant a charge of conspiracy.

    Mr. Mueller's team drew no conclusions about whether Mr.
    Trump illegally obstructed justice, Mr. Barr said, so he
    made his own decision. The attorney general and his deputy,
    Rod J. Rosenstein, determined that the special counsel's
    investigators had insufficient evidence to establish that
    the president committed that offense.

    The AG said that, despite the fact that the Mueller report laid out ten
    cases where there was sufficient evidence of obstruction -- but because
    of the DOJ policy against charging a sitting President they could not do anything about it.

    Dale Shipp
    fido_261_1466 (at) verizon (dot) net
    (1:261/1466)


    ... Shipwrecked in Silver Spring, Maryland. 00:09:30, 10 Apr 2022
    ___ Blue Wave/DOS v2.30

    --- Maximus/NT 3.01
    * Origin: Owl's Anchor (1:261/1466)
  • From Dale Shipp@1:261/1466 to Gregory Deyss on Mon Apr 10 00:16:02 2023
    On 04-09-23 21:38, Gregory Deyss <=-
    spoke to Alan Ianson about Re: Who's at war <=-

    Presidential Records Act (PRA) of 1978
    Source:
    https://www.archives.gov/presidential-libraries/laws/1978-act.html One such provision states "Establishes in law that any incumbent
    Presidential records (whether textual or electronic) held on courtesy storage by the Archivist remain in the exclusive legal custody of the President and that any request or order for access to such records
    must be made to the President, not NARA."

    Of course, we can expect that you will either cherry pick or only read
    until you find something that you think supports your position. Notice
    the word "incumbent" in what you quoted.

    The very next bullet point next to the one you quoted says:
    "Establishes that Presidential records automatically transfer into the
    legal custody of the Archivist as soon as the President leaves office".

    Dale Shipp
    fido_261_1466 (at) verizon (dot) net
    (1:261/1466)


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  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Gregory Deyss on Sun Apr 9 23:03:22 2023
    Exoneration and for that matter Collusion are meaningless because they are not considered to be legal terms.

    They are legal terms. Mueller had no power to charge or exonerate Trump.

    Trump was not charged with any crime, and the report exonerates him of nothing.

    Is this what Trumps defense will look like? That's all right wing spin.
    I know nothing of Trumps legal team, it's common knowledge, and every word of it is true. Bragg is soft criminals it was really a bonehead move to have all the cops at the court house on that day along with what was a media circus, crime did happen on that day elsewhere in the city, it was a like a criminals Christmas.

    That's just more spin unless you can back up that statement with facts.

    --- BBBS/Li6 v4.10 Toy-6
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  • From Gregory Deyss@1:267/150 to Dale Shipp on Mon Apr 10 07:53:05 2023
    Of course, we can expect that you will either cherry pick or only read until you find something that you think supports your position. Notice the word "incumbent" in what you quoted.

    What do you think referencing clips from CNN and suggesting the Russian Dossier
    is real and not fake, which it is totally fake.

    Here's the real truth you as well as Alan don't like Donald Trump.
    Each of you see no value in former President's Trumps term.
    You think that all of these nonsense or so called legal challenges will stop him. Trump did nothing wrong with ANY of them. They are terrified of him, its
    quite oblivious. If ANY of them could stop Trump why does Mr. Trump have the highest polls and it's only April, in other words what are "you people" so terrified about. I would think that you would be worried about WWIII, that is before us, if Biden remains. Trump is talking about peace.

    Even though there are hundred's of positive examples of what was the Trump Administration.
    You two can't even get behind America First, of which is pathetic.

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  • From Gregory Deyss@1:267/150 to Alan Ianson on Sun Apr 16 21:14:58 2023
    Is this what Trumps defense will look like? That's all right wing spin.
    I know nothing of Trumps legal team, it's common knowledge, and every
    wor
    it is true. Bragg is soft criminals it was really a bonehead move to
    have
    the cops at the court house on that day along with what was a media
    circu
    crime did happen on that day elsewhere in the city, it was a like a
    crimi
    Christmas.

    That's just more spin unless you can back up that statement with facts.
    Think so? Then do come to NYC, but I wouldn't be looking like a tourist.

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  • From Alan Ianson@1:153/757 to Gregory Deyss on Sun Apr 16 20:43:28 2023
    That's just more spin unless you can back up that statement with facts.

    Think so? Then do come to NYC, but I wouldn't be looking like a tourist.

    I wouldn't expect you to look like a tourist since you are a new yorker.

    It's all spin regardless of what you look like.

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